PEDRO: THE MOVIE

[sean]

[Garth Ennis's story in 'The Boys' is pretty scathing].

what story does this refer to?

I'd have to flip through the books again, but I think it's in Book Two, there's a story about a gay superhero that gets almost derailed at least once (I think twice) by monologues about how just making a character gay and having them get assaulted as a hate crime is more insulting to real-life gay people than using the word "cocksucker" (or maybe "fag", I forget), because it's essentially saying that the only way a gay man's sexuality can be used in a story is to make him a victim because of it.  Or something to that effect -- I remember thinking he wasn't wrong, but that it was jarringly out of place in the middle of the story.  I assume it was directed at Winick because "Hate Crimes" was Winick's big story about his gay character.

Honestly, I don't remember *how* the speeches tie in, because they're almost unrelated to anything else in the story.  Besides the Winick thing, it's also an answer to critics who says Ennis characters use those words too often.

[Rich]

Speaking of The Boys, how did everyone feel about the 9/11 stuff?  I liked it, but it is like the third comic revisionist take on that day.  Is this really going to be this decade's dead horse, a la the 90s "everyone scowls and dresses in black"?

[sean]

I had a mixed reaction, largely similar to yours (it sounds like).

- Ennis's response to it -- Butcher's monologue -- seemed very genuine and heartfelt and emotional, and saved a comic that could've really gone off the rails.

- Bringing the conspiracy / coverup idea into it was where it really could've gone wrong, but, somehow, I never got the sense that Ennis was espousing "9/11 Truth" by doing so, so I didn't mind.

- The thing itself was difficult to look at, but I thought it made the entire point of the whole series very, very well within one issue... so, when it was done, I thought it was a solid book that I probably wouldn't want to read again.

- And it did bother me that he chose to use a real-life tragedy, when he could've just as easily made it a school blowing up in Pennsylvania (thanks a lot, Speedball!).  The speech at the end pulled it back, but it was uncomfortable to read (successfully so, since I'm sure that was deliberate, but still...)

When I first read 'Ex Machina', I almost put it down after issue #1, because I *hated* that twist, and thought that to boil 9/11 down to a cheap twist ending was wrong on numerous levels.  However, I did think issue #2 made sense of it... I just wish they'd found a better way to tell the audience that.

What's the other revisionist take?

[JCEFalconi]

I liked it, the whole comic is a big fuck you to the genre and ennis seems to be having a lot of fun with it. What other superhero take on 911 is there, besides Ex Machina?

Also ennis is really the king of comics you don't want to look at too long, has anyone read Crossed? GOOD GOD.

[sean]

I was lucky enough to read '303' after the hype, which I had ignored, had died down, so *that* ending managed to floor me.  I can't believe that Ennis got away with that, even from Avatar.

[sean]

What other superhero take on 911 is there, besides Ex Machina?

Ri ch, did you mean Dr. Doom crying?

[Rich]

I guess Marvel's 9/11 isn't all that revisionist, really.  They just show up afterward.  

I'm actually surprised those are the only 9/11 supe books, I felt like there were a bunch more.

[JCEFalconi]

Now I know why they call you fart with a beard.

 I liked the Ex Machina thing too, but then again I don't even live in the country that was attacked, I think it did help ground the book in a superhero reality, because, if you asked anyone at which time the US needed a superhero the most, the mayority would probably say 911.

[DerickA]

I guess Marvel's 9/11 isn't all that revisionist, really.  They just show up afterward.  

I'm actually surprised those are the only 9/11 supe books, I felt like there were a bunch more.

It's revisionist if you accept that this crazy mass murderer dude is all of a sudden crying at the random loss of life.

Maybe he's crying because he didn't think of it.

[Cuppy]

This movie was a travesty on every level.

I am so disappointed.

[Dalton]

This movie was a travesty on every level.

I am so disappointed.

Really?  "A travesty"?  I thought it was pretty ok what what it was (a made for basic cable movie). 

[Cuppy]

Really?  "A travesty"?  I thought it was pretty ok what what it was (a made for basic cable movie). 

The revisionist history was insane... puck with the swastika shirt? Really?

[Dalton]

The revisionist history was insane... puck with the swastika shirt? Really?

According to Judd Winick the swastika thing did happen.  I don't recall it making it to the show, though.  But the rest of the scenes from the Real World were recreated pretty much exactly as they were.  You really think it was revisionist history?  Puck was a scum bag.  He said in a interview "good riddance" after Pedro died.

I will admit the acting was pretty terrible, but all in all it wasn't nearly as bad as I thought it would be.

[Cuppy]

According to Judd Winick the swastika thing did happen.  I don't recall it making it to the show, though.  But the rest of the scenes from the Real World were recreated pretty much exactly as they were.  You really think it was revisionist history?  Puck was a scum bag.  He said in a interview "good riddance" after Pedro died.

I will admit the acting was pretty terrible, but all in all it wasn't nearly as bad as I thought it would be.

The acting was terrible... the chronology  stunk (is that a diretors fault?) and if the shirt thing did happen it certainly wasnt a part of that particular argument which was about picking scabs and peanut butter.

If a new generation gets exposed to pedro I would rather they just rerun the season.

[Dalton]

The acting was terrible... the chronology  stunk (is that a diretors fault?) and if the shirt thing did happen it certainly wasnt a part of that particular argument which was about picking scabs and peanut butter.

If a new generation gets exposed to pedro I would rather they just rerun the season.

The skipping around in time didn't bother me in the least.  It was pretty clear the writer or director wanted to address the bulk of the Real World months first, and then fill in background information.

And yeah, a few of the Real World scenes were composites of several conversations, but that is done all the time in biopics.  It doesn't constitute revisionist history.

MTV.com has put up the entire San Francisco season on their site.  I've been watching it but it's annoying that they have replaced the 90s music with generic crap.